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PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-25-2010, 10:15 PM
..........mods if this is not the best place please move..........

Ok I'm working on a delsol and I'm wanting a cage for it, I want it to be a full nasa/scca complient. So my question is were is the best spot to get it done. I'm looking to get done toward the end of jan. Please let me know thanks.

SlowCivicHmm
12-25-2010, 10:32 PM
look at spending a good amount of coin......and it does vary by shop...

I've been looking for a shop to do my cage, to me it all came down to who I wanna support really, plus who knows what I'm doing with the car, and hopefully they drive themselves and they know safety........

You have in no specific order and no affiliation:

FutureFab
PressicionChasis sp?
Fathead Fabrication

Those were my top choices.......but i ended up going with a diff shop!! lol...small mom and pop race prep shop that does custom cages...I'm good in with the owner..hehe

But I'd look into those 3, and let them know what you want and get prices....you'll be surprised by cost, but hey its your safety...can't put a price on that....

FYI: these cages are not for DD....once you properly pad it etc etc....MAYBE.....but really?? and I know its badass..I've wanted to do it for a long time!! but its a PITA

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-25-2010, 10:39 PM
Ya im planning on making this car track only and I have talked to a few and was quoted around 2600. Who were you looking at pm me if your willing to give up the place. And I want to make sure it gets done right the first time.

BlueTeg
12-25-2010, 11:30 PM
I've seen cages from John at Future Fab, Junior at Fathead, and Kent at Precision on quite a few cars that drive with NASA. They're all great fabricators and will do a great job. You can't go wrong with any one of those 3.

And I want to make sure it gets done right the first time.

Keep in mind that they don't have every sanctioning bodies rules for each class memorized, you will want to make sure that *you* understand the rules and tell the fabricator exactly how you want the cage built.


I would really recommend that you come out and drive a few HPDE days before investing that much money into a track car though. Your preferences for how you want the cage built may change after you have some experience under your belt. Or after you gain some experience you may decide that you want to use a different platform for your long term track toy. Unless you have a bigger budget than most Honda guys that HPDE/road race/time attack, once you get that cage put into that car, you're not going to want to change to different one.

If you're hell bent on having the cage installed now, before you hit the track then I would recommend reading this: http://www.nasaproracing.com/rules/ccr.pdf
(specifically page 72 - 77 which details the specs for a roll cage to pass tech)
Also keep in mind that NASA only requires a cage for wheel to wheel racing. They do not require a rollcage for HPDE 1, 2, 3, 4...which is what you'll be driving in for at least a year before you have the opporutunity to join race group.
It's not a requirement for you to have it put in before you hit the track and have some fun.

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-26-2010, 12:23 AM
Thanks for the tips, im still looking into everything. I know that part of the cage is supposed to be welded to the roof. I need a lot more seat time, But I have been on the track before in acouple diffrent cars( this car is stiped down right now) and it was a fun car on the track, and I have just alway felt safer with one. And I'm not rushing on the cage its just kinda one of the other parts I'm looking to do.

BlueTeg
12-26-2010, 12:36 AM
No problem.
On a side note: no portion of the cage *has* to be welded to the roof.

ILIKETODRIVE
12-27-2010, 08:17 AM
On a side note: no portion of the cage *has* to be welded to the roof.

x2

If you want insight into how one is supposed to look:

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x47/kcpaz/IMG_6372.jpg

http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x47/kcpaz/IMG_6367.jpg

AZ_CIVIC
12-27-2010, 08:25 AM
Future Fab.

topramn
12-27-2010, 08:28 AM
You can find all the information you need to know about building a NASA legal cage @ http://www.nasaproracing.com/rules/ or http://www.nasaproracing.com/rules/ccr.pdf

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-27-2010, 10:21 AM
No problem.
On a side note: no portion of the cage *has* to be welded to the roof.

I don't rember were I read it but it was something about cause it was a targa top,

x2

If you want insight into how one is supposed to look:

Thanks for the pics, who did your cage.

Future Fab.

I'm starting to here them more and more.

You can find all the information you need to know about building a NASA legal cage @ http://www.nasaproracing.com/rules/ or http://www.nasaproracing.com/rules/ccr.pdf

Thanks. Ill keep reading up.

AZ_CIVIC
12-27-2010, 10:35 AM
I don't rember were I read it but it was something about cause it was a targa top,



Thanks for the pics, who did your cage.



I'm starting to here them more and more.



Thanks. Ill keep reading up.

If you go to Future Fab they know every single rule you will need to know. Just tell them what you want to do and they will tell you everything you will need to pass any inspection and they will fab it however you want. Just give John at Future Fab a call at 602-738-2593.

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-27-2010, 10:58 AM
Ya ill give him a call here in acouple days, still have a few more things I need to finish.... and wow the honda challenge does not like some of my engines, also who do you call to see if you can use an engine.

topramn
12-27-2010, 11:22 AM
Ya ill give him a call here in acouple days, still have a few more things I need to finish.... and wow the honda challenge does not like some of my engines, also who do you call to see if you can use an engine.

Honda Challenge is a Spec series. The rules only allow certain modifications to the engine to focus more on the skill of the driver. If you have built engines, I would suggest PT as you can do more stuff to your engine and car but again be sure to read and understand the rules of the classes that you can run in.

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-27-2010, 11:39 AM
I know there spec I just thouht you could do a little more. And I'm wanting it to be set up for a few diffrent classes( I have a few engines ) but I'm slowly getting things going on the car.

LoooseGSR
12-27-2010, 01:18 PM
Having raced in HC locally for a brief stint, and been around the Honda RR scene since about 2003, i can tell you that I'm actually considering building my Civic to get back into HC down the road because of the new rules with limits on HP. Before, H1 was the money class, but realistically H2 and H4 ended up being where everyone went and you still had the issue of budget. People would go out and thousands to get every last bit of HP out of a motor to keep it legal(this is why Spec Miata is now a 20-30k class to run up front, with something like 130-140 hp coming from 5-10k engines). Honda Challenge has always been about doing what you can do with OEM Honda parts, no FI, no crazy slicks, just going as fast as you can with what Honda has out there. The new HP numbers are realistically attainable, and will hopefully attract more racers that have been on the fence for a while now.

As for your cage, go safe, don't over-complicate it, and DO YOUR RESEARCH!!! Nothing worse than showing up ready to drive with a car that has a cage that doesn't meet the CCR Requirement.

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-27-2010, 02:24 PM
I like the limites but my h22a type s I guess you can't run. My itr has to stay 100% stock, and I have no idea if I can run my f20b, but that's kinda why I'm working on suspention, brakes, and safty first. And I really want to get back out there.

ILIKETODRIVE
12-27-2010, 02:43 PM
I know there spec I just thouht you could do a little more. And I'm wanting it to be set up for a few diffrent classes( I have a few engines ) but I'm slowly getting things going on the car.

Not a bright idea.

If you plan on doing competition events, build a good car for a single class instead of an OK car for 2-3 classes.

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-27-2010, 03:10 PM
Not a bright idea.

If you plan on doing competition events, build a good car for a single class instead of an OK car for 2-3 classes.

I will build a good car I promise no hack job, but I do want to run in a acouple classes. And I have found acouple I can with the same setups.

ILIKETODRIVE
12-27-2010, 03:55 PM
I will build a good car I promise no hack job, but I do want to run in a acouple classes. And I have found acouple I can with the same setups.

Such as...? Please elaborate.

For instance: My car was maxed out in NASA TTE (same rules as PTE) and did well (2 track records). It would have qualified for H4 (with LS gearing) BUT would have been completely out-gunned by a proper H4 car (no camber kits/no aero/would need to add 100+lbs of ballast).

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-27-2010, 04:55 PM
I was kinda think h4 and improve touring, and there still will have to be afew changes. But that's what I'm thinking, I'm still working on a few diffrent ideas. My engine is kinda the last thing for me, I have enought diffrent ones out my house to decide the better for that and what to do, my mane goal right now. safty, suspention, and brakes.


What set up are you running if you don't mind me askng.

BlueTeg
12-27-2010, 09:00 PM
Dude, just throw in whatever engine is most covenient for you now. Get some seat time, get your suspension, brakes, etc. sorted.

You may get out there and find out that you would rather compete in Performance Touring due to the contingency awards available. Or maybe the contingency awards or comradery of Honda Challenge will be more lucrative. In either scenario the cage requirements will be the same.

Basically right now you're trying to pick out what kind of wedding dress and ring you want for your future wife. Get out there and just take her on some dates, have some fun, before you start worrying about the big picture that's down the road.

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-27-2010, 09:44 PM
At this point in time the car is stripped. So I can't just throw an engine in and go.

topramn
12-27-2010, 10:50 PM
I like the limites but my h22a type s I guess you can't run. My itr has to stay 100% stock, and I have no idea if I can run my f20b, but that's kinda why I'm working on suspention, brakes, and safty first. And I really want to get back out there.

If it is not stated as being okay in the rules, it is against the rules. So, your statements are correct. You cannot use the H22A Type S, the ITR must remain stock, and the F20B isn't listed in any classes so there most likely is no class for it. If you don't agree, you may contact the Honda Challenge National Director for more information. These issues that you are having already are why we recommend that you drive with the organization and learn what is competitive locally and then once you are familiar with the rules and have answered any questions that you might have, then you build a car.

Additionally, there are at least 2 Honda Challenge cars (Civic EG) for sale here in Phoenix and a 3rd one sitting around that you could probably get the owner to part with if you found a way to reach the guy and made the right financial offer. Those are between $6000-$8000. There was also a CRX that was an H4 car in Tucson that was under $4000 but I am not sure on the availability of that one right now. By the time you do brakes, suspension, safety items, you might have been able to buy a car and already driven between 2 and 6 events. Lots to think about.

I wish you luck in whichever route you choose but find your way to the track and get involved with the people sooner than later. They are a great source of information.

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-27-2010, 11:10 PM
The engines I have have been in and out of car before, so they wernt just for this, and I'm trying to get the time off to make it out next month.

LoooseGSR
12-28-2010, 09:54 AM
I was kinda think h4 and improve touring, and there still will have to be afew changes. But that's what I'm thinking, I'm still working on a few diffrent ideas. My engine is kinda the last thing for me, I have enought diffrent ones out my house to decide the better for that and what to do, my mane goal right now. safty, suspention, and brakes.


What set up are you running if you don't mind me askng.

Just to clarify, I figure you're talking about PERFORMANCE Touring and not IMPROVED Touring, because you should know, an Improved Touring can definately run in HC, but a car prepped for HC CANNOT run in IT. SCCA has some weird rules for IT cars that must be followed to the letter and they aren't performance oriented.

ILIKETODRIVE
12-28-2010, 12:36 PM
Just to clarify, I figure you're talking about PERFORMANCE Touring and not IMPROVED Touring, because you should know, an Improved Touring can definately run in HC, but a car prepped for HC CANNOT run in IT. SCCA has some weird rules for IT cars that must be followed to the letter and they aren't performance oriented.

Troof.

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-28-2010, 10:53 PM
Well I'm tring to get another del sol right now so I caj get out ther and drive, I'm going and looking and most likly buying one tomorrow.

Kinetic
12-28-2010, 11:10 PM
I moved this thread to the welding fab area because it started off being about cages...then I see it turned into a whole another thing.....


I'll sort this one out later

PENTAGRAM_OF_EVIL
12-28-2010, 11:13 PM
I moved this thread to the welding fab area because it started off being about cages...then I see it turned into a whole another thing.....


I'll sort this one out later

That's fine I almost put it there but wasn't sure were I would get the best response.